he was a reverend and he worked in the men's restroom. he would greet people and talk to them. he met ronald reagan. reagan gave them his cufflinks and he wore them every day. some key lawmakers say the obama care website may work just fine -- for identity thieves. this is "special report." good evening. i'm bret baier. you can add privacy concerns to the growing list of complaints about the president's disastrous health care overhaul rollout. it seems those potential obama care customers who are able to penetrate the website's unintentional front-end security gauntlet may be delivering their most private information on a silver platter to the bad guys. we have fox team coverage. brit hume looks at the shelf

life. ed henry is at the white house with distension among the american troops about the promise to keep your health insurance. but we begin with correspondent peter. >> reporter: two men in two states tangled up in a mess created by an error at healthcare.gov which caused a breach of private information that nobody in the government has been able to explain to them. a few weeks ago, south carolina attorney tom doogle shopped around at healthcare.gov but thought the plans were too expensive. so he went on with his life until friday, when a stranger named justin in north carolina called to say that his brand-new healthcare.gov eligibility notice contained personal information about tom and his wife. >> i didn't know if he was trying to phish for my personal information or if he really had

my personal information. >> reporter: tom has tried calling, e-mailing and live chatting healthcare.gov. but so far, nobody has been able to fix this mix-up. >> there is no system for reporting a security breach. any bank or any other secure online system you can easily report potential security breaches. >> reporter: they explain, quote, we identified a piece of software code that needed to be fixed and that fix is now in place. >> health care is a very personal decision. the insurance you sign up for, you don't want other individuals necessarily knowing that there are security laws, privacy laws place to protect people. >> reporter: there's no telling how many consumers may have received information. a hole has been highlighted that

has lawmakers worried about high-tech hackers. >> you have criminals trying to get information that is now available on these websites. >> reporter: until the site is secu secure, rogers think it should be taken down. >> i felt and i said this directly to the president's chief of staff, they ought to take down the website until it was right. >> reporter: tom's now pleading with his congressional delegation to help lock down the compromised data. but he says his problem isn't with d.c. >> i've got no political ax to grind. i just want my information off of this website. >> reporter: this afternoon, republican south carolina senator lindsey graham's office says they are working to help tom. over the weekend, we learned that for now, healthcare.gov is not a 24-hour-a-day website and that applications will be unavailable every day from 1:00 a.m. till 5:00 a.m. eastern and maybe longer.

>> peter, thank you. there appears to be a major shortage of obama care customers at this point. there is no change of potential scapegoats for the rollout's difficulties. ed henry tells us who's getting the blame now. >> reporter: yet another week kicks off with new questions about the white house's credibility around the botched rollout of president obama's health care law. a former aide acknowledges, there was a disagreement inside the white house over whether americans could keep their current health care plans. >> i don't recall significant discussions around some of the verbiage on this -- >> do you agree it was a wrong move? >> certainly. >> reporter: yet at the white house, give successor jay carney would not acknowledge there had been a debate. >> it was not a point of debate that i participated in.

>> reporter: as top white house advisers and allies continue to come up with new ways to insist the president was not wrong. >> if you had a plan before the affordable care act, you can keep it. >> reporter: in what amounts to a blame game for the insurance industry. >> insurance companies don't like the individual market as constructed. they see the future. that individual market is going away. they don't want to invest in it. the insurance companies are making that -- >> it's not the president. >> reporter: meanwhile, republican darrell issa released more internal meeting notes with one memo stating, quote, the paper applications allow people to feel like they are moving forward in the process. at the end of the day, we are all stuck in the same queue. that raises questions about claims made by the president himself that consumers can bypass the website and apply faster by phone. >> once you get on the phone with a trained representative, it usually takes 25 minutes for an individual to apply for coverage. >> reporter: questions about

that drew a sarcastic response from carney. >> i get it. but the person who calls -- >> the president said you could apply within 25 minutes. that's not true. >> there's a reason to be quizzic quizzical. you call up, give your information, you get the answers to the questions you have. >> reporter: meanwhile david cutler confirms to fox he wrote a memo more than three years ago warning the administration they had to make drastic changes. cutler telling "the washington post," quote, they were running the biggest start-up in the world and they didn't have anyone who had run a start-up or even run a business. all reasons why republicans continue to insist implementation needs to be delayed. >> i'm calling on the president now to say, let's have a time-out on this, mr. president. you call a time-out on this. >> reporter: we asked an

insurance industry group reaction to what the president's allies said on the sunday shows. they directed us to their website which says the reason why most policies are being canceled is because the consumers decided to change the coverage, do something different, buy a new policy. and now because of the new law, they have to deal with those new regulations. bret? >> ed henry, thank you. if you're wondering when the tornado of turmoil over obama care will die out, you're not alone. president obama would like to know, too. senior political analyst brit hume is here with some thoughts. good evening. >> hi, nice to see you. one thing politicians caught in a firestorm such as the current ones can hope for is that the thing will quickly die down once the news value is exhausted. unfortunately for the president, that does not seem to be happening. first came the website fiasco. then the stories of hundreds of thousands of policy cancellations. that's now followed by reports of people losing their doctors as well.

incidents are now beginning to surface of people who managed to logon to the obama care website, being shocked at the prices of available health plans or the size of deductibles or both. now comes news the site will go down each night as the administration troubleshoots it to rewrite more and more of the code. given the security issues noted earlier, would you be willing to provide private health insurance to a site undergoing such changes? and the fact that president obama's repeated assertions that you would be able to keep your plan and your doctor were no mere exaggerations but knowing and deliberate falsehoods. this time, the media as a whole are coming down the administration's smokestack. and the administration's continuing evasion seem only to be feeding the story. as the saying goes, this thing has legs. >> you have "the new york times'" editorial which says mr.

obama clearly misspoke when he said that pledge. >> he misspoke some 20-some times. i have to say that i think it stands alone out there. the paper's own coverage, that of much of the rest of the mainstream media has been delving into this with decidedly negative consequences for the administration. i was watching a morning show to see what the conventional wisdom is about things in washington. and it was all negative. we saw a piece of it. robert gibbs there, saying it was a mistake and so on. the administration has very few defenders here and it doesn't seem to be getting better. >> thank you. stocks started the week in positive territory. the dow gained 24. the s&p 500 up six. the nasdaq finished ahead 15. you may not see much evidence of it outside of people news. but tomorrow is election day.

they continue to hang onto the coattails of their more famous endorsers. here's an update. >> reporter: hoping for a last-minute surge in a low turnout race, ken cuccinelli brought along starpower to culpepp culpepp culpepper. marco rubio is a referendum on president obama and the affordable care act. >> the president running for governor on the democratic side, not only supports obama care, he actually thinks it doesn't go far enough in the direction of government control. >> fight back against the president and obama care and tear him apart and do it with our votes tomorrow right here in virginia. tomorrow is our day, folks. tomorrow is our day! >> reporter: the latest quinnipiac poll shows terry mcauliffe leading by six points. it has robert sarvis with 8%,

much from conservative voters who might otherwise vote for cuccinelli. cuccinelli campaigns alongside ron paul. among male voters, cuccinelli leads. surveys suggest his supporters are more energized than mcauliffes. but the democrat has a big lead with women. vice president joe biden hit the trail with him this morning. >> ken cuccinelli's focused his entire career on issues that divide virginians. >> everything they talk about without exaggeration is about turning back what the rest of the country and the world thinks is progress. >> reporter: over the weekend, president obama was at mcauliffe's side as well. >> nothing makes me more nervous than when my supporters start feeling too confident. so i want to put the fear of god in all of you.

virginia historically has always been a swing state. and this race will be close because past races in virginia have always been close. >> reporter: this time in virginia, each side is focused mostly on what they like least about the other. republicans want voters to come out in droves and vote against obama care and the rest of the president's agenda, while democrats say the referendum should be on the tea party and social conservatives. >> carl, thank you. so who wins in virginia? let me know on twitter. up next, another body blow to obama care. but first, here's what some of our fox affiliates across the country are covering tonight. fox 35 in orlando with the official start of the new charlie crist gubernatorial campaign. the former republican governor is running again, this time as a democrat. fox 29 in philadelphia with details of a huge bribery scandal involving a u.s. navy

commander, a legendary defense contractor and offer from one of the other prostitutes and lady gaga tickets. it all is one story, believe it or not. this is a live look at los angeles from kttv. the big story there tonight, accused l.a.x. shooter paul ciancia under sedation and under guard. police say he accomplished both of his goals, killing a tsa officer and showing how easy it is to get a gun into an airport. that's tonight's live look outside the beltway from "special report." we'll be right back. we went out and asked people a simple question:

how old is the oldest person you've known? we gave people a sticker and had them show us. we learned a lot of us have known someone who's lived well into their 90s. and that's a great thing. but even though we're living longer, one thing that hasn't changed much is the official retirement age. ♪ the question is how do you make sure you have the money you need to enjoy all of these years. ♪ (dad) just feather it out. (son) ok. feather it out.ears. (dad) all right. that's ok. (dad) put it in cond, put it in second. (dad) slow it down. put the clutch in, break it, break it.

(dad) st like i showed you. dad, you didn't show me, you showed him. dad, he's gonna wreck the car! (dad) he's not gonna wreck the car. (dad) no fighting in the road, please. (d) put your blinker on. (son) you didn't even give me a chance! (dad) ok. (mom vo) we got the new subaru because nothing could break our old one. (dad) ok. (son) what the heck? let go of my seat! (mom vo) i hope the same goes for my husband. (dad) you guys are doing a great job. seriously. (announcer) love a car that lasts. love. it's what makes subaru, a subaru. at od, whatever business you're in, that's the business we're in with premium service like one of the best on-time delivery records and a low claims ratio, we do whatever it takes to make your business our business. od. helping the world keep promises.

kand i don't have time foris morunreliable companies.b angie's list definitely saves me time and money. for over 18 years we've helped people take care of the things that matter most. join today. another potential blow to obama care. a major court ruling against the birth control mandate. shannon bream is here tonight to tell us how it's going.

how close are we to the supreme court taking up this birth control mandate issue? >> it could happen within a matter of days. more than 70 of these cases are spread across the country. a handful of them have made it to the courts. it's likely it will be the hobby lobby, that national craft chain store. if they are forced to provide no-cost access to drugs. the government as well is also acting to hear this case because there's a split in the lower courts. there was that ruling on friday by the d.c. circuit that citizen business owners do have a religious liberty that can be violated if they're forced to comply there's a vote ongoing currently -- might be closer to a controversial piece of legislation going to the final vote, if it passes this hurdle. what's this all about? >> we're looking to see if they get to the 60 votes to the

nondiscrimination act. the stated goal of this legislation is to make sure that there's no discrimination in the workplace based on sexual orientation for gender identity. both people who oppose and support the bill say they support that, that everybody should be treated with dignity in the workplace. their fear is this is going to get tricky for religious employers. there are religious exemptions built in. they have worries. if it makes it through the senate ultimately, it's going to face an uphill battle in the house. john boehner says he's going to oppose the bill. it could launch frivolous litigation and cost americans jobs. nancy pelosi says they'll keep all options on the table to keep it through the house. and jay carney said if it doesn't get through, he would not rule out the potential use of an executive order by the president. >> i think we're at 57 yes

votes. but still a few minutes away, we're told. let's be honest, if it does not make cloture here, the 60 votes needed -- >> it's done. >> it's done. >> and there are key republicans we have to watch on this that will provide the extra votes. >> we'll watch it. shannon, thank you. the supreme court will hear the challenge to president obama's recess appointments to the national labor relations board. arguments will be presented on january 13th. the social security administration is defending itself after word that hundreds of people are losing federal benefits because they are wrongly listed as dead. on the flip side, over the past few years, social security doled out more than $133 million to dead people. the administration admits the death master file is not 100% accurate. and it says all other federal agencies use that file as their own database for paying benefits. still ahead, why one obama care supporters says canceling your insurance policy is really a good thing. first, mending fences among

friends in a very unfriendly part of the world. have hail damage to both their cars. ted ted is trying to get a hold of his insurance agent. maxwell is not. he's on geico.com setting up an appointment with an adjuster. ted is now on hold with his insurance company. maxwell is not and just confirmed a 5:30 time for tuesday. ted, is still waiting. yes! maxwell is out and about... with ted's now ex-girlfriend. wheeeee!

whoo! later ted! online claims appointments. just a cli

the country's top diplomat is on a foreign policy triage mission. secretary of state john kerry is busy mending fences with middle eastern allies unhappy with what president obama is doing and not doing. chief washington correspondent james rosen takes a look. >> reporter: it was the largest anti-american demonstration in iran in years. and it occurred 34 years to the day after iranian militants at the same location seized the u.s. embassy in tehran and took scores of americans hostage. to many in iran, the u.s. remains the great satan, even as the core complaints are updated.

>> they wiretap their allies. how can they compromise with their archenemy. >> reporter: in secretary of state john kerry confronted the perception among america's arab allies that president obama is to eager to cut a deal with iran on its nuclear program. >> nothing that we are doing with respect to this negotiation will alter or upset or get in the way of the relationship between the united states and saudi arabia and the relationship in this region. >> reporter: saudi foreign minister denies iran's relationship with the u.s. is deteriorating but warned washington against growing too heavily invested in the talks with iran. in cairo, former egyptian president mohamed morsi ousted by the military in a coup last july arrived for the opening of his trial on charges of murder and incitement to violence. defiant, the muslim brotherhood leader told the judge, i am egypt's legitimate president, i

refuse to be tried by this court. chanting in the courtroom led the judge to adjourn until january. visit cairo on sunday, secretary kerry downplayed the issue. >> this aid issue a very small issue between us. i think it's important for all of us until proven otherwise to accept that this is the track egypt is on and to work to help it to be able to achieve that. >> reporter: kerry has now touched down in poland will we will likely face more questions about the nsa. on thursday, kerry acknowledged nsa surveillance has in some cases reached too far inappropriately. but he insisted innocent people are not being abused by it. bret? >> james, thank you. clashes broke out over the weekend in france between police and protesters of a so-called eco tax. police fired tear gas and water cannons at thousands who hurled stones and other objects at them. protesters want the tax on large

commercial transports permanently scuttled. the wildly unpopular tax has been postponed repeatedly since its approval four years ago. really, this happened. a soccer match in serbia had to be halted for ten minutes saturday after fans hurtled volleys of flares on the field. the smoke threatened to choke the spectators at the intracity contest. fire trucks moved in quickly to try to quell the bonfire. 25 million reasons why one man is not giving up on the bin laden family. and do you live in an islamic country without even knowing it? "grapevine" is next. is a daily game of "what if's". what if my abdominal pain and cramps come back? what if the plane gets delayed? what if i can't hide my symptoms? what if?

but what if the most important question is the one you're not asking? what if the underlying cause of your symptoms is damaging inflammation? for help getting the answers you need, talk to your doctor and visit crohnsandcolitisinfo.com to get your complimentary q&a book, with information from experts on your condition. they're the days to take care of business.. when possibilities become reality. with centurylink as your trusted partner, our visionary cloud infrastructure and global broadband network free you to focus on what matters. with custom communications solutions and responsive, dedicated support, we constantly evolve to meet your needs. every day of the week. centurylink® your link to what's next. and our giant idaho potato truck is still missing. so my dog and i we're going to go find it. it's out there somewhere

spreading the good word about idaho potatoes and raising money for meals on wheels. but we'd really like our truck back, so if you see it, let us know, would you? thanks. what?

medicare open enrollment. of year again. time to compare plans and costs. you don't have to make changes. buit never hurts to see if u can find

bettoverage, save money, or both. and check out the preventive benefits you get after the health care la open enrollment ends december 7th. so now's the time. visit medicare.gov or call 1-800-medicare now to the political grapevine. is america an islamic country? a member of the homeland security's department advisory council says it is. the comment was made during an exchange on twitter after posting the conservative perception of islam has to evolve. the washington free beacon was the first to notice a twitter user challenged, show me just one example of an islamic country where nonmuslims are treated with equality? he responded, america. and, yes, i do consider the united states of america an islamic country with an

islamically compliant constitution. move on. the free beacon says he's served on the d.h.s.'s counter violent extremist group. his twitter profile says his opinions are personal. new york democratic mayoral candidate bill de blasio admits he's not a morning person. he kept supporters attending a morning rally waiting more than an hour on saturday because he overslept. ironically he urged a crowd at a women for de blasio event to stay awake for three days until polls closed tuesday at 9:00 p.m. he says really there's no reason to sleep in that time frame and suggested that espresso and red bull would take them through. finally, a michigan man s s says -- tom lee, a u.s. citizen

of egyptian heritage says a pakistani intelligence agent told me he escorted bin laden and his family from peshawar to another city. his attorneys say lee has made numerous attempts to collect the $25 million award but has received no responses. american officials said it was electronic evidence that located bin laden so no reward will be paid. also several published reports suggest bin laden's three-story compound in abbottabad was not built until 2005, which contradicts lee's story. some of the most vocal critics of the president's health care plan have begun calling it a socialist ponzi scheme. tonight, jim angle looks at how the law appears to have at least one component of infamous swindles. robbing peter to pay paul. >> reporter: a former health adviser to the obama administration argued on fox news sunday the wave of policy

cancellations is justified because they were substandard and that people who held them might need uncovered care, which would simply shift their cost onto others. >> they're inunder or have low insurance. they transfer these costs to the rest of us. that's the whole point of part of obama care, to eliminate this cost shifting. >> reporter: but obama care doesn't eliminate cost shifting, it magnifies it because the new health care law is a massive cost-shifting exercise itself, forcing the young to pay more for the old, the healthy to pay more for the sick and even men to pay more to offset the cost of women. >> premiums are going up because they're allowing people to come into these markets who are already sick and they're unable to charge them a higher price because they're sick. so those costs get shifts to everyone else. >> reporter: older people can only be charged as much as three times as much as younger people. >> what that means is that younger people are subsidizing older people in this law because

health care costs for older people run more than seven times more than the cost for younger people. >> older and sicker people who tend to have more money. and that's why obama care has an individual mandate trying to force young and healthy people to take that deal. >> reporter: many plans obama allies call substandard offer plenty of coverage and would not have shifted costs. >> lots of insurance plans out there today covering hospitalizations, doctor services, drugs, they're in the individual market, regulated by the states. they don't need the federal government telling them what they need to get. >> reporter: the argument of substandard is a way to justify the cancellations in spite of of the president's promises that people could keep their plans and doctors, period, leaving no room for exceptions. >> jim, thank you. the senate's just voted to

invoke cloture on the judgment to proceed for the nondiscrimination act. as we told you a short time ago, the bill would prohibit gay and lesbian employees in the workplace. this law ensures the bill will pass later on this week. again, cloture has been invoked and seven republican senators voting if that at this hour. it's monday, that means the bing pulse is powering up. go to our home page. you can watch some of the simple instructions there. it is your chance to sit on the panel. you can provide your feedback, what the panelists are saying, monitor the whole thing. you can also access the pulse on your smartphone or tablet at bing.com/politics. why there's one group thrilled that the obama care website. we'll talk about it and the problems with the fox all-stars

when we come back. [ woman 1 ] why do i cook? to share with family. [ woman 2 ] to carry on traditions. [ woman 3 ] to come together even when we're apart. [ male announcer ] in stuffing, mashed potatoes, gravy and more, swanson makes holiday dishes delicious. his day of coaching begins with knee pain, when... [ man ] hey, brad, want to trade the all-day relief of two aleve for six tylenol? what's the catch? there's no catch. you want me to give up my two aleve for six tylenol? no. for my knee pain, nothing beats my aleve.

i came home friday night from taking my wife and kids o mail from a gentleman in north carolina who was trying to contact me to see if i was the person that he had personal information on. i can't imagine if the system is this unsecured, what's going to happen if a professional hacker tries to get into it. >> i felt and i said this directly to the president's chief of staff, they ought to take down the website until it was right. >> the real threats to these systems when you have nations, states and organized crime groups and criminals trying to get information that is now available on these websites, they need to take the site down, stabilize it. >> what about the security concerns for obama care?

it's another element to this story. let's bring in our panel, stephen hayes, julie pace, white house correspondent for the "associated press," and tucker carlson. steve? >> the problem is if they came down the website until it's right, that's likely to be six months and long beyond that. then you get into the problems we discussed before. you have the sickest people signing up. you have other people incapable of signing up. do you penalize them? do you not? it creates, i think, and exacerbates a set of problems the white house doesn't want to deal with. if the white house doesn't make this decision now, they get themselves further into trouble and make the ultimate decision that much more difficult. i think these are the kinds of things being debated behind closed doors at the white house and elsewhere with ceos of insurance companies and others. we've got to make a decision. what do we do and when do we make this decision? every day that passes, i think they can make their problems that much more difficult. >> they are trying to lower expectations, clearly, julie.

dan pfeiffer this weekend on abc. >> our goal is to get as many people done as possible. i can promise the first enrollment numbers released later this month won't be what we want them to be. there's no question the website hasn't worked the way we want it to work. >> the enrollment figures, getting ready for those numbers november 15th. but you have dianne feinstein, mike rogers, a number of lawmakers now saying, this is a real problem. >> security is starting to be one of the things we're hearing about more and more. two of my cleggs at a.p. obtained a memo from the administration that said because of insufficient testing, there was a possibility that there was a high security risk involved with this site. we're now told by the administration that those security risks have been abated. but what that memo also said was that it would take six months of

mitigation efforts to ensure the security risks were not there. we don't understand how you can go from that position four days before the rollout to now saying there are no security risks. >> two things. this is not the only confidential information the executive branch of the government has of yours. what is happening to these data? there's a lot that could be exposed. i agree with both julie and steve. they don't have a lot of time. the backdrop to all this is they need to sign up an awful lot -- in fact, all healthy people in america in order to subsidize the poor and the sick. if they don't, the economics of this don't work. by the way, there are also political pressures coming to bear. they can't raise the penalties for noncompliance. they'll alienate young voters. so they're going to wind up with a system that doesn't work. the math will not work. >> votes on bing.com/politics,

will the administration gain tractions by blaming insurers for obama care problems. 90% say no. here's an interesting one about security information. how concerned are you about providing your personal information to healthcare.gov? a lot, 98% so far. as you can see the realtime tracking here on bing. steve? >> i think we're heading toward a problem where if the insurance companies -- the big question, will the insurance companies continue to stick with the administration and try to solve the problems behind the scenes while the administration and public is out trashing the insurance companies? the president gave speeches saying, these are bad apple insurance companies that want to cancel these policies for greedy and evil purposes. will the insurance companies stick with him? right now, all indications that they will. part of that is because in the original bill, there was something of a bailout for insurance companies and the insurance companies don't want to delay the individual mandate because they need these consumers. but there comes a point when the ceos of these insurance companies say, this is too much.

we can't handle this. this is going down. we don't want to be a part of this while it goes down. and we're going to set out to do something different. >> the big story over the past few days has been the president and this voracity issue with, you'll keep your plan, if you want it. they are trying to explain this out a number of different ways. "the new york times" said they misspoke. this is the president today earlier talking about this. >> if we had allowed these old plans to be downgraded or sold to new enroll lees had already passed, we would have broken an even more important promise, making sure americans gain access to health care that doesn't leave them one illness away from financial ruin. >> essentially saying, i broke that promise but we had a bigger promise we remembern't going to break. >> what he said in that clip before that, he said to that audience, we said you can keep

it if it hasn't changed since the law's passed. that wasn't said. that wasn't said by officials or by the president. that may be what's written into the law. and they may believe that's good policy. they say when this comes to fruition, we'll look back on this and say, that was a smart idea. but no one said that. and there is an element of trust here. this is something that politicians hold very dear to themselves, their trust with the public. if that starts to break, you're going to add to that a long list of problems with the obama care policies. >> we counted 27 times, i think. and we probably missed one or two. >> i think "the new york times" was right. the president did misspeak when he said you can keep your health insurance if you like it. i think what he said was, if we like your health insurance, you can keep it. if we approve, it's okay. >> does this story continue to have legs -- >> it does because it's something people care about. you saw the nsa go away, the syria debacle. people feel threatened about their health care.

they want to choose their own health care. you're seeing this in jay carney's behavior. >> we'll go to the white house briefing room after the break about the issue of filing by paper application or over the phone. what's the difference? there are seniors who have left hundreds of dollars of savgs on the table by not choosing the rit medicare d plan. no one could hav left this much money here. whoo-hoo-hoo! yet many seniors whoompare medicare d plans

test test talk to your cvs prmacist, ll, test test call, go online, or visit your local store today.

once you get on the phone with a trained representative, it usually takes about 25 minutes for an individual to apply for coverage. >> did the president know that the very same problems would be facing consumers when they called on the phone when he said that they could apply in 25 minutes -- >> john, as you know, the answer is yes, as was reported widely at the time. the whole point was to beef up

the calling centers to give the american people were looking for information a way to avoid the frustrations they were having online. >> he said you can bypass the website and apply by phone or in person and it can be done in 25 minutes. in 25 minutes. these memos say at the end of the day we are all stuck in the same cue because they all have to go through the same portal. >> john, i get it but the person who calls isn't the one who continues to wait after the paper application is filled. >> you are mock something entertaining but the president said you could apply within 25 minutes, that was not true. >> the point was to relieve some of the frustration that americans were understandably experiencing. >> white house briefing room a little tense today. jonathan karl with abc asking those questions. this goes back to a story first reported on abc from an h.h.s. war room memo released by the house oversight and government reform committee in which it says, quote, the paper am captions allow people to feel like they are moving forward in the process.

at the end of the day, we are all stuck in the same cue. in other words, it has to be put in the web site. we're back with the panel. it's interesting to watch these briefings get more tense as the days goes go on. >> who says the white house briefings aren't no fun. come on. this is another angle of the story that is going to have some legs mostly because you can't get on to the web sight, so you do have to call over the phone out you do have to fill out a paper application at this point. and there has been this sense that that is a faster, easier way for you to enroll in healthcare and if everybody is getting funneled eventually through healthcare.gov and healthcare.gov is still having problems well then that's simply not happening. >> bing, are you surprised the furor over obama care has not passed? no, 94% here on the tablet. and then will obama care the individual mandate be further delayed? 73% yes. 27% no. tucker, your thoughts?

>> it's a application process. the operator is there to make you feel good but doesn't expedite it at all. it goes to the same place into the ether. it watch jay carney to attack john karl of all people who is a good reporter and fair and smart person shows you the depths to which they have sunk. it's appalling like it's john karl wants fault for having a totally straightforward and honest question. carney as a reporter part of him has got to know this is not an adequate response to a straightforward question. they don't have another answer. it's another sign of their desperation i would say. >> steve? >> the whole point is they are trying to make people feel better over a process that doesn't work. it's not ultimately going to make people feel better whatsoever if they call and making progress if they are in fact not making progress. that's the problem with the entire explanation of what's going on for the first five weeks of process. they can't provide process. they can't say things are getting better everybody

should feel better about it when jay carney goes up and makes a comment or dan pfeiffer on the sunday shows or the president in a speech and pretends that things are actually improving when people know they are not. again, we have made this point before. this is no longer theoretical to americans. everybody has either been on the web site or made a call or gotten cancellation letter or knows someone who has gotten a san cancellation letter. they see and feel it every day. >> julie, ezekiel immanuel out on "fox news sunday" saying it's really about the equation here that this all matters. >> there is a potential death spiral if we don't get enough people signed up. by the way, it's not in just six months. we have a couple years to get this up and running and working. my firm belief and everything we know from massachusetts is we will get those people. >> it was just an eye opener to say potential death spiral four the one of the

architects of obama care. >> this is one of these plans where not only do you need about 7 million people to sign up by march 31st but you read the right mix of people, you need people healthy, generally young and haven't felt an incentive and don't necessarily feel incentive to buy healthcare. you need get them it to sign up. these are people who tend to be tech savvy who want to registeron line. they don't want to fill out a paper application and make a phone call. if they don't get the right mix of people it's going to make costs go um. that is actually i think the biggest concern in all of this. put the web site problems aside. put some of these issues with the president's rhetoric aside, if this plan doesn't have the right mix of people, there are going to be pretty widespread policy changes. >> you are not asking healthy people to buy healthcare. you are asking healthy people to buy other people's healthcare. that's a key. it's a matter of people who don't need it subsidizing the healthcare of those who do. we know where this is going. it's not going to work. force people at gunpoint to do so. that's politically

impalatable. do the obvious thing expand medicaid and medicare. the person who is leading the virginia race terry mcauliff has made this a platform. expanding medicaid in the state of virginia. that looks pretty popular. they are going to drop the numbers for eligibility, make people who make more money than they do now he would jingle bell for medicaid. drop the retirement program for medicaid and those programs will get bigger. >> the problem is some doctors aren't taking medicaid anymore. >> some? a lot of doctors. >> the you can keep your doctor is not working in that scenario. >> states have the option to opt out of medicaid expansion. the idea of doing. this this is where they ultimately end up. i think tucker is right probably a couple of years. better than the political argue. you are hearing people like ezekiel immanuel make on the sunday shows where he has to basically embrace this paternalism where he says you don't know what's best, we know what's best, that's why you have to do it. >> somethin' tells me this won't be the last panel on this topic. i'm just guessing. stay tuned for clarification

from the white house on obama care and what is really the key. plus the sr bing pulse highlights. me a lot of time. after reading all the reviews i know i'm making the right choice. online or on the phone, we help you hire right the first time. with honest reviews on over 720 local services. keeping up with these two is more than a full time job, and i don't have time for unreliable companies. angie's list definitely saves me time and money. for over 18 years we've helped people take care of the things that matter most. join today.

here are the bing pulse highlights people agreed with steve taking counsel the web site taking down the web site. the math of obama care will not work. all parties agreed with julie that the president has endangered the trust of the american people have had n. him there was high agreement when steve asserted trying to make people feel better without making a difference. total votes tonight 227,000. we talked about all uproar over the president's promise if you liked your healthcare you could keep your healthcare plan period there is a real effort to try to clean that up. the white house released this video apparently from three years ago. >> if you like your doctor,. >> you cannot, keep your doctor. >> if you like your private health insurance plan. >> cannot. >> keep your plan.

>> thanks for insight us into your home tonight. fair balanced under -- and unafraid. greta goes "on the record" right now. press secretary jay carney, we have video cameras, they record what you say. >> i never said that you wouldn't -- that the process the end point of the process wouldn't have to go through healthcare.gov. >> while the web site will ultimately be the easiest way to buy insurance through the marketplace, it isn't the only way. >> there are four ways, not just online. >> you said there are four ways to enroll in exchanges by phone, in person, at local healthcare centers or by mail by the web site. you said there were four different ways. there is only one way. it all has to go as you just said healthcare.gov. >> again, you can tap